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Gtir Motorsport club » General Discusion » Gtir related Discussion » From 1 bar to 1.2 bar

From 1 bar to 1.2 bar

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1 From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 15th August 2015, 5:20 pm

Digitalfaze

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Thinking i could do with more boost so wondering what is needed to take it to 1.2bar, currently sitting at 1bar via an avcr, standard maf, injectors, fmic, walbro, everything was checked prior to putting the boost to a bar.

http://www.avaloncreative.co.uk

2 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 15th August 2015, 5:53 pm

buckym120

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Standard Maf and injectors should be fine but will be at the very top end of there limits so for peace of mind z32 maf and bigger injectors or fuel pressure reg and then back in for a remap

3 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 15th August 2015, 6:01 pm

Digitalfaze

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Do i need a remap? Im still on standard ecu, what sort of injectors would suit? Im guessing ill need a remap if changing injectors?

http://www.avaloncreative.co.uk

4 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 15th August 2015, 7:37 pm

Stu

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I have seen many pulsars running 1.3bar on standard afm and injectors.
you could idealy do with some sort of fuel control before raising the boost to 1.2bar
mines ecu or the like is the cheapest option as its already mapped.
just get it on the rollers to have the fueling checked while running the boost pressure.
many gtirs back in the day would run 1.2bar on standard ecu with only a walbro fuel pump for the extra fueling.
I had a hks afr on mine running 1.2bar.


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5 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 15th August 2015, 8:00 pm

MartyMG

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You will need a Nistune board added to your standard ecu to remap it or buy one that's had it done. Evo redtop 560cc injectors are a popular upgrade & ideal for your power level. EBay normally has plenty for sale! I ran my standard ecu, maf & injectors at 1.2 bar without problems (328.5 bhp) but as stated, that's maxing theiinjectors out.

6 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 15th August 2015, 8:09 pm

nomad

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As stu says many have run 1.3 ive even seen 1.4 on standard everything although that is proper limit duty cycle of injectors ....evo red top injectors is your next step up .... depends really on what you want to achieve in the end as no point buying shit twice and remapping the same ...


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7 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 15th August 2015, 9:29 pm

gtir_pimp

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I would get a good fuel pressure reg and set it up on a dyno to check fuelling is good unless you have or buy a wideband then can be done on the road but dyno is safer and can see what power it makes.

Simples

8 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 15th August 2015, 9:41 pm

Stu

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Standard fpr is fine for 1.2bar.
I would take it to a rr and ask them to raise the boost and check the fueling with the set up he has.


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9 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 15th August 2015, 10:03 pm

johnny gtir

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Bob might correct me but 1.2-1.3 mainly 1.2 is a lot more achievable on a standard set up than people have been lead to belive. Sure a simple manual boost controller and trust worthy genuine walbro or similar and fpr is all that's needed

I am sure he has proved this a few times now and even achiving a better more drivable car making similar if not more power than it came in with running a nistune

10 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 15th August 2015, 10:24 pm

Stu

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Its been proven for years that thats all you need for 1.2/1.3bar
People are wasting good money having a nistune and only running 300/330bhp!
Its the dodgey tuners trying to get peoples money that spread rumour that its un safe!!!
Lets face it. They say the gtir is at its maximum bhp of the standard engine at 350bhp lol
Anyone that has been around these cars long enough has seen or done more than most.
They say the injectors and maf max out at 330bhp
I have seen cars hitting just shy of 350bhp on standard turbo. Injector and maf!
Now thats the limits!
Yes you can get better performance or should i say you wont be at the tipping point with bigger injectors. Maf and turbo.
Its not needed for upto 1.3bar tho!
As long as the fueling is okay. You should be safe.
These ecu's are mapped wet as standard.
Cars vary tho. So as always. Check the fueling when raising boost!
Its what £60 for a power run with cans etc. Thats better than paying for a rebuild..


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11 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 15th August 2015, 10:35 pm

Mr B

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I done it cheap & easy many years back with a breaker sourced z32 fuel pump & air meter, a sard fuel pressure regulator & a unichip on standard engine & gt28rs.
Air meter is pretty much maxed out at 1.3bar, injectors at 3bar pressure are also pretty much maxed out so used the sard to run at 4bar, z32 fuel pump is a tough beast way better than the walbro pumps.
Do note just changing a fuel pump does not change fuelling, you need up fuel pressure or change to bigger injectors. the pump is purely to maintain the required pressure/flow. when setup that ran at 1.3bar sweet with sensible injector duty cycle  & 1.5bar with not so sensible duty cycle ..
Age of these cars now means you more likely have serious issues pushing things to edge on standard parts.
A good standard engine would take good 350hp for years, it mainly bad servicing & bad setup of fuelling that killed the engine/pistons.

12 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 15th August 2015, 11:32 pm

GTI-R US

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As a few have told you si you do not need a remap to run 1.2 bar despite what other so called tuners may say.
It's merely said to gain extra work and line people's pockets.

We have run 1.3 bar with good aftermarket fpr to up fuel pressure and as long as the ignition and fuel system is in tip top condition then you won't have a problem plus the car will not be bogging mid-range with way too much fuel as I've seen many times now with some mapped cars, this is a dangerous game and WILL cause major engine failure.

We have nistune, Motec, pfc and many other options for remaps but don't waste your money at that level your aiming for as that is well within spec of the stock ecu as we've proven time and time again with great results


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13 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 16th August 2015, 12:19 am

hreggtir

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did have mine at 350bhp 1.4 bar, but even though I would have loved that and the torque figures which I think was similar, Bob may remember, but after a quick discussion thought it would be best to drop down to 1.3 and is now 330 odd, again with similar torque figures.
one thing I will say if you get a sard fpr then try to avoid ebay, there are a lot of reviews on the interweb about how most on there are fake so just be careful I found this place

http://www.indigo-gt.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=161_226_257&products_id=3727

they do the gauge separately for around £22 but don't show it on their website, they do do it though just ask them.


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14 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 16th August 2015, 1:25 am

gtir_woody

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I've used one of those sard regs, and it worked great, not a problem at all and good for the price. I'll recently upgraded to a turbosmart reg now.

15 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 16th August 2015, 8:32 am

Whytie

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I ran 1.4 tailing off to 1.2 on stock set up for years, thumbs up when I got it checked on the rollers, kicked it's cunt in everywhere including trackdays.

I would spend the extra cash and get it done correctly so your not on limits, the gtir I had at the time I couldn't give two fucks if it had blown up. Like Bob said my ignition set up was always changed regularly

16 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 17th August 2015, 7:52 am

Welling_AL

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Just to mirror what some have said above - had my R over 10 years - ran it standard boost for the first few to get use to it - then got FMIC and fuel pump and went 1 bar with bleed valve - held 1 bar strong no issues for a few years - then got a Dawes Device and set it to 1.2 peak tailing off to hold 1.1 - again worked a treat - had it like that for years. Fuelling checked on rolling road - all good.
Everything standard wrt ECU - injectors - MAF - FPR so it can be done but as above good to check levels for peace of mine - no need to spend big monies.
AL.

17 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 25th August 2015, 12:04 pm

Digitalfaze

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Sorry for the late reply, been on holiday Smile what do you advise for ignition setups? 1.2 bar is the limit im gonna take the car too, hopefully if it will make 300-330 which is my magic number.

So just a fpr will be suffice, i will get injectors and z32 if it will help the engine more

http://www.avaloncreative.co.uk

18 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 25th August 2015, 12:30 pm

Mr B

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Standard ignition in good order is fine.
Injector duty cycles on 1.2 are not good & maf is also floating at end of its measuring range, I would prefer go good piggyback or full ecu as allows some finer adjustments & with slightly bigger injectors duty cycle can be sensible, some ignition mapping is useful too for power & safety.
used piggybacks & ecus are damn cheap these days.
All down to budget really & how well your car really runs at 1.2bar, at 25yrs old things don't work as well as did & have issues when pushed harder.
Most of the issues with cranks & ringlands is all down to poor setup & servicing, wrong fuelling either way, det & heat issue will kill a good engine in a weekend.
Be real fussy who use to check/map it as many are really clueless besides talk & excessive billing ...

19 Re: From 1 bar to 1.2 bar on 25th August 2015, 1:30 pm

GTI-R US

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@Mr B wrote:
All down to budget really & how well your car really runs at 1.2bar, at 25yrs old things don't work as well as did & have issues when pushed harder.
Most of the issues with cranks & ringlands is all down to poor setup & servicing, wrong fuelling either way, det & heat issue will kill a good engine in a weekend.
Be real fussy who use to check/map it as many are really clueless besides talk & excessive billing ...



^^ very true what's written above
if the fuelling system, ignition and all ancillary components are in good order then the car will be fine at 1.2bar and possibly more but you never can tell until you check it on Dyno under varying load conditions and at different engine / ambient temps as useless checking on a cool winter day when in summer she will run hotter with far higher ambient, intake and charge temps. So best to set it up and check with higher temps although she will make more power with cool dense air which you get in winter.

We generally back off timing at base which makes things a little safer or if you want to run say 1.4bar boost then if you can get one then use a sunny gtir ecu as they have a retarded ignition map from stock.
But as said 1.2 bar is really no issue if everything is all working as it should be


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