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Gtir Motorsport club » Tech room » Gearbox section » Pete (the box slayer) rebuild

Pete (the box slayer) rebuild

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126Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 16th September 2016, 6:46 pm

johnny gtir

johnny gtir
moderator
moderator
Interesting I normally use women's hands and mouth/throats to measure my shaft

127Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 16th September 2016, 7:48 pm

Stu

Stu
Admin
Admin
@johnny gtir wrote:Interesting I normally use women's hands and mouth/throats to measure my shaft
Shocked censored Laughing
Naughty naughty hahaha


_________________
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http://www.j10-meets.co.uk

128Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 16th September 2016, 9:07 pm

shroom

shroom
@johnny gtir wrote:Interesting I normally use women's hands and mouth/throats to measure my shaft

Na its a micrometer you use dude! Lol

129Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 17th September 2016, 7:25 am

gtir_woody

gtir_woody
moderator
moderator
@johnny gtir wrote:Interesting I normally use women's hands and mouth/throats to measure my shaft

Good call piss taker

130Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 21st September 2016, 12:41 pm

Cosmic73

Cosmic73
Well, it's all been happening this end,  Very Happy
Measured the input, main and diff shaft depths in the outer casing;  Very Happy
Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Img_2014
Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Img_2013
Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Img_2015

Depths are,
Input shaft; 220.923
Main shaft; 216.74
Diff shaft; 47.57

I also pressed on both the new bearings onto the diff;  Very Happy
Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Img_2016
Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Img_2018
Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Img_2017

Just the required shim widths to work out.............

131Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 21st September 2016, 1:42 pm

Cosmic73

Cosmic73
Please could someone check these bearing clearance sums based on the official SDS data?
Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Captur10


Input shaft case depth=220.923
Shaft height=219.850
Gap=220.923-219.85=1.073mm
Nominal play required (according to SDS)=0.03mm
Therefore shim thickness=1.073-0.03=1.03mm

main shaft case depth=216.74
main shaft height=215.85
Gap=216.740-215.85=0.89mm
Nominal Pre-load required (from SDS)=0.27
Therefore shim required=0.89+0.27=1.16mm

132Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 22nd September 2016, 7:10 am

Mr B

Mr B
gtir technician
gtir technician
@Cosmic73 wrote:Please could someone check these bearing clearance sums based on the official SDS data?
Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Captur10


Input shaft case depth=220.923
Shaft height=219.850
Gap=220.923-219.85=1.073mm
Nominal play required (according to SDS)=0.03mm
Therefore shim thickness=1.073-0.03=1.03mm

main shaft case depth=216.74
main shaft height=215.85
Gap=216.740-215.85=0.89mm
Nominal Pre-load required (from SDS)=0.27
Therefore shim required=0.89+0.27=1.16mm

Input would work out 1.043 from your numbers but I would be suspicious of that as seems too low a gap for standard shims . I'm on lunch so if turns an easy afternoon extended break will add shim specs .

Mainshaft seems about right and would be highest end of shim range.

Mainshaft preload is most important be spot on
input is easy measure with shaft in casing & using a dial gauge measure float on shaft tip.
Similar can be done for final drive diff using a dial gauge & a bar on other side to move the assembly & get reading.
I done my main with fsm instructions & then used soft metal strips (assembled-crushed-measured) as a comparison measure.

133Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 22nd September 2016, 8:23 am

Cosmic73

Cosmic73
Thanks Mr B,
I've borrowed a dial indicator from work so i'll be able to double check the input float after assembly,
Mainshaft is a blind, so like you say, can't be checked after assembly,
Diff is pre-loaded. So how can a dial indicator check it's float if it doesn't exist??

134Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 22nd September 2016, 8:58 am

Mr B

Mr B
gtir technician
gtir technician
^
Because you do a dummy build of the diff without shims fitted behind bearing outer race & use dial gauge to measure the float thus give you base measure to calculate shim for preload .
I got a 3 or 4 page pdf pulled from the fsm on it . will link you to it as handy print and have in hand on the build .

135Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 22nd September 2016, 9:08 am

Mr B

Mr B
gtir technician
gtir technician
Gearbox shaft shimming.pdf


looking at nissan parts they do input shims in range of your measures so you could be on the mark with that but easy check once installed .
On one of mine I skimmed largest shim already had to specific size rather than order 2 smaller ones to get spec . think lot of the shims used in few other boxes so could be quick to get some .



Last edited by Mr B on 23rd September 2016, 9:25 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : added shim sizes pages to pdf)

136Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 22nd September 2016, 6:34 pm

Cosmic73

Cosmic73
Cheers Mr B,
This morning i tried to get the shims ground down to size but they were too thin for grinder's magnetic table to hold.

Pete if you want your mate to custom make these shims then heres the data he needs in mm,

Input shim,
Id 70, OD 76.8, thickness 1.04

Mainshaft shim,
Id 52, Od 58.8, thickness 1.16

Diff shim,
Id 91.3, Od 97.9, thickness 1.44

Your mates to meet a thickness tolerance of at least +- 0.025mm (+-0.005mm preffered)



Last edited by Cosmic73 on 25th September 2016, 12:35 pm; edited 1 time in total

137Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 22nd September 2016, 7:35 pm

Mr B

Mr B
gtir technician
gtir technician
What I done was mill the shim profile in offcut of steel and shallower than shim spec , made a clamp that covered little under half of shim then skimmed to size on mill and rotated in holder to complete full face of shim .

138Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 25th September 2016, 12:34 pm

GTIRSI

GTIRSI
Events Organiser
Events Organiser
Nice work mate Very Happy can't be long before it's done now ? Pete must be getting excited bounce

139Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 26th September 2016, 6:38 am

PartyPete

PartyPete
the one star club
the one star club
Yes si very close now Very Happy

Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 16FD4545-A57A-430F-A85B-8C8404EFBF5B_zpsrnt8vvys
Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 AEC14B88-6AD8-40BE-BE1D-C6F73E5D5B00_zpsc2l1yu7q
Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 F4E1DACE-8E39-4C56-9D49-6063E3D63F2E_zpsdrwvksdi
Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 67ECEE2F-2506-4416-BBDB-C858933C9A73_zpsqxnh45sb

My mates dad has made the shims to the exact specs, he makes engines for fun! Would have been another months wait from Nissan!!! So taking them to Niels tomorrow night to finish the box Very Happy

140Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 26th September 2016, 8:38 am

gtir_woody

gtir_woody
moderator
moderator
Getting soooo close, loved watching the updates on this.

141Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 26th September 2016, 8:58 am

PartyPete

PartyPete
the one star club
the one star club
Cheers woody Very Happy. So close now! Should have it all back together for this weekend fingers crossed! Been nearly 5 months now, can't wait to get it running and see how it goes....

142Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 26th September 2016, 2:27 pm

johnny gtir

johnny gtir
moderator
moderator
Something seriously wrong if it don't work. Don't think you would find anyone willing to put the amount of effort that's gone into this mate

143Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 27th September 2016, 10:10 pm

Cosmic73

Cosmic73
Well thats it, all done and dusted now. Very Happy
Pete's just took the box home and only needs to push in two diff seals and and refit it.  Very Happy
We worked till 11pm and have followed the manual to the letter so it fails again then all i can say is i did my best chaps.
But im sure it'll be fine..............touch wood  Wink

144Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 27th September 2016, 10:53 pm

nomad

nomad
Admin
Admin
Well done neil top work .... rep given Wink


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145Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 28th September 2016, 4:25 am

Mr B

Mr B
gtir technician
gtir technician
Fingers crossed .
Got better chance than most of the general gearbox rebuild shops as pete's experience highlights :-(
Just break it in with bit of respect & do a minimum of 1 oil change on a semi synthetic before jumping to a fully synthetic, I would do 2 oil changes, one at 150 to 200 & then at 350 to 450 .
New syncro's can take a few thousand miles before best shifting so don;t hammer it from day 1 .
Hopefully pete will be changing his signature soon to evil evo killer, well done to cosmic fornhelping out .

146Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 28th September 2016, 7:56 am

johnny gtir

johnny gtir
moderator
moderator
@nomad wrote:Well done neil top work .... rep given Wink

Massive respect to you mate very kind of you and just shows how much needs to be checked/measured I have certainly learn a lot from this. Fact you have done it plus a thread to show rep your way

147Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 28th September 2016, 9:00 am

gtir_woody

gtir_woody
moderator
moderator
^ I couldn't agree more, great to see the time and dedication that's gone into making sure its built right and while also helping someone out. Rep given aswell mate thumbsup

148Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 28th September 2016, 9:26 am

PartyPete

PartyPete
the one star club
the one star club
It was a late night for me getting home, I really enjoyed helping Neil put it all back together,very interesting to see and try and learn a bit!
I genuinely can't thank Neil enough for what he has done, he's Gone out of his way for me on this to just help a stranger out...top bloke!!.

Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 7E7A1044-5F6A-4922-9840-32051D08B617_zpspy2hj0zl

Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 6E374022-8D9E-4790-BCBC-270C34880D25_zpsh5o2xnjp

Heating the case up to fit the bearing Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 9795F3EA-5460-44FA-B5E5-50D704A445FF_zps9phlpxod

All back together

Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 2700D24B-2035-467F-A008-25DCF44007FE_zpsjv9cj3su

Just a few pics there putting it together.
I also appear to have the later casing with the 10mm bolts as opposed to the more common boxes with the 8mm bolts (stronger boxes so I'm told) so just ordered a new bolts set from Italy so my gear box end brace will fit!
It will all be back in the car for Saturday and hopefully running. I'm sure Neil didn't fit any new synchro's as they were all well within there tolerances...but I will be doing a 100 miles plus bed in on 30% throttle max before another oil change.
So I will update and let every one knows how it goes at the weekend!
Even if it goes wrong again Neil has done his absolute best with this and I'll put it down to just shit luck!!! Rep point given but I owe him a lot more than that!! Fingers crossed for me people

149Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 28th September 2016, 11:02 am

Stu

Stu
Admin
Admin
Neil is a top bloke! Loads of browny points earned lol
Good to have you on board our club Neil. Smile


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150Pete (the box slayer) rebuild - Page 6 Empty Re: Pete (the box slayer) rebuild on 28th September 2016, 12:00 pm

PartyPete

PartyPete
the one star club
the one star club
Thanks to you as well stu for donating your main shaft thumbsup

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